Welcome to your last week of reading and blogging for this book club! We will meet during PIR days to discuss in person and hand in your handouts. I really appreciate you all taking time out of your summer to learn more background knowledge! Thank you.
This weeks assignment:
-Please finish the book.
Questions to answer:
-How would you use this story in the classroom?
-Please analyze the differences in this book and Counting Coup. Both were written by non-natives. There are many things that can be pointed out. Please refer to Oyate's site and use the questions that it poses for Native American literature to answer this question. Here is the link : http://www.oyate.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=135&Itemid=107
-How did this book club impact your background knowledge? Would you recomend others to do this book club?
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
I would use this book as a read aloud book in grade four and above. After reading the book with the students I would put small groups together to research and present various Indian boarding schools from the early 1900s. I would expect each group to give a presentation on their assigned school , including a history, student life, and perhaps some replications of student work from that time period. (Could be fun to have my students recreate an Indian club routine.)
ReplyDeleteI can also see students completing a unit that would involve recreating in an Indian boarding school, having small groups design the lessons on various subjects that the children of Fort Shaw participated in.
The authors of the two books have two very different spins on the characters they were writing about. In counting Coupe the characters were predictable in terms of stereotypes and the readers were shown very little diversity among the various characters. In Full- Court Quest the characters were colorful, well defined, and diverse. I suppose what I am saying is that in reading Counting Coupe the stereotypes of Native Americans came alive and in Full- Court Press the characters came alive. It was clear that the authors of Full-Court Quest researched their book throughly, as is evident by the notes shared at the end of the book, where as the reader can assume that Counting Coupe was researched or not..
I became more informed on the Indian boarding schools of the early 1900s and the impact these schools had on Indians past and present. I also had the opportunity to reflect on how literature can and has either honored the Indians history and people, or caused unwarranted humiliation. It is important as educators to say well informed and continue to grow intellectually , so participating in this type of experience is valuable.
I would use this story in the classroom to research boarding schools, but only if I taught an upper grade. I had the same idea as Sue as far as learning about other boarding schools and presenting the findings. I also think you could do a unit on other famous and successful Native Americans and compare their backgrounds to that of Jim Thorpe and the girls in Full Court Quest. It would be interesting to study other important (non-native) sports figures from the same era and compare upbringings and advantages/disadvantages.
ReplyDeleteI think the main difference between Full Court Quest and Counting Coup is one of documented research. Larry Colton wrote his novel in the first person, leaving me to think much of his book was based on conjecture and personal feelings. I may have appreciated it more if he had footnotes like Full Court Quest. I would have liked to have seen his interviews documented. This would have made exactly where and when he obtained his information more obvious. I am mainly thinking of the stereotypes. Many of them came from people other than Larry, but I would trust the information more if it were documented. Oyate says to look for whether or not Native cultures are presented in a condescending manner. I do feel that they were in Counting Coup. Oyate also says to look for whether or not there is one or more positive role models with which a Native child can identify. I have to say, there was in Counting Coup. I loved reading about Janine Pease Windy Boy, whom I find to be a role model. I find both positives and negatives in Counting Coup.
As far as Full Court Quest goes, I have no problem with this book. Not everything in the book is positive, but I believe the authors did a thorough job researching the facts. This period in time is not a good one, but these authors did a good job of allowing the reader to learn about the characters, the school, and its administration. It was easy to come to care about these kids and feel for what they went through. I like the more factual nature of it. Although the authors are non Native, I feel they did a good job and followed Oyate’s guidelines for the most part. They definitely wrote about the Natives as individuals and gave background information about their tribes and ancestors. I was immediately drawn in by their description of the relationship between Pea –boa and Minnie Burton. I loved that Minnie wanted to be as good at Double Ball as her grandmother. This is all documented. They used facts to draw in the reader.
This book club did a lot to add to my background knowledge. I learned more about stereotypes and they stand out to me more now when I hear them. I learned a lot about boarding schools and find myself wanting to know more about the other ones. I learned more about individual tribes and the role sports played in the lives of these children who were being assimilated so far from home. I would recommend this book club to others. The books themselves taught me a lot and I enjoyed reading them, but above all, I appreciated hearing from my peers. In many instances, my opinions changed based on what you all had to say. Many of you pointed out things I had not thought of. In this sense, I could read the books with many points of view, which is incredibly valuable. Reading these as part of a book club, rather than just reading them myself, was very powerful. Thank you, Kim, for making this possible for us.
This book was a well written story. The authors used citations, cited people’s personal stories and recollection and they gave the reader background knowledge to explain each girls background. This book surprised me in many ways. Here are the things that the authors did do to make this book credible:
ReplyDelete1. They showed Native peoples as human being and members of highly defined and complex societies.
2. Native peoples societies were shown as separate from each other, with each culture, language, religion, dress, unique.
3. The language is respectful.
4. History was put in the proper perspective: the Native struggle for self-determination and sovereignty against the Euro-American drive for conquest.
5. Shows the Ft. Shaw women as Native heroes that are and were admired because of what they do for their own people.
6. Native values of cooperation, generosity, sharing, honesty, and courage were seen as an integral part to growth and development.
7. Women were portrayed as the integral and respected part of Native societies that they really are.
As one can see the authors for this story really went above and beyond for this story. They truly cared about presenting the girls in a positive light, strived to give background knowledge so the reader had an idea of what made these girls who they were. As I stated in an earlier post about Counting Coup, this author’s work did not fit the guidelines that Oyate has given to educators for a book that should be used in the classroom. The author told a story, but failed in my view to really break bias and stereotyping of American Indians.
How I might use this story in my classroom is during the last week in September for Native American week for the state of Montana. During this week I focus on stereo-typing of American Indians. This book would be a great one to read excerpts from to show how natives are real people with unique culture and talents. I am always looking for great examples of American Indians to use during this mini-unit. These girls show the complexities of human life and are not the stereo-type image of an Indian Princess. I love this aspect of this true story!
I really want to thank my fellow book clubbers for all their hard work. I really enjoyed the perspectives all my peers even if I did not see things the same way. I enjoy seeing others perspective it helps me things more clearly. I learned a lot concerning how sports influenced American Indians in a positive way just as it does today for all cultures. With assimilation these children needed something positive in his or her life. This was a great way to share ideas. I will be continuing the book clubs throughout the school year. I hope to see you again at another book club.
Kim
One way I might consider using this story in the classroom is to assign chapters or sections to be read as homework (or use some class time) and have students jot down quotes or passages and have them lead discussions on why they chose that passage and how it did or did not fit the guidelines that Oyate has given to educators for books to be used in classrooms. Students could, for example, look for loaded words and point out insulting overtones to the language in the book. Students might also find passages where the language is respectful and point out these passages for the class to consider and debate.
ReplyDeleteWhile I somewhat agree with Kim that these authors did not completely break bias and stereotyping of American Indians, they did a much better job of following Oyates’ guidelines than did Larry Colton in Counting Coup. The assignment described above would allow students and teachers to critically evaluate how well the guidelines were followed. I think the authors tried hard to show Native peoples as human beings, members of highly defined and complex societies rather than savages or simple tribal people. Compared to the stereotype wording published in the headlines of local papers where the girls basketball team was playing and other excerpts from individuals referring to the students or a particular tribe, the authors came away respectful to me. The “why our girls lost” cartoon found on page 120 shows this type of stereotype that still confuses me and I believe too much of this stereotyping continues today. Recognizing and acknowledging stereotyping is a good first step educators and students can use to combat it in today’s society
I agree with Sue and Dori about how reassuring the documentation in this book is to making it a more credible story. As you might have guessed, I especially enjoyed all the references throughout the book that described or shed light on how people felt about the team during the time of their great run. It really let me feel the mood of the general public 100 or so years ago.
This book club has had a great impact on my background knowledge of Native Americans. Thank You Kim for organizing and sharing. I would recommend it to others and am hoping the next one includes more Native American authors. It is nice to see both perspectives, but I must admit I enjoyed hearing Jim Thorpe’s story mostly from him.
Nathan,
ReplyDeleteI would agree that there were some bais in this book, but it seemed to be more historical like you pointed out with headlines. I do believe this book followed much of what Oyate is looking for.
The book clubs before this were Native American author based. I wanted to show a little more of non-native writing to show the difference between the writing styles (though Bruchac is Native and did a wonderful job). I have a few planned for this year, one being Native author based and one that will not be. Thanks for you input Nathan. I really appreciate it.
Dori- I really like how you looked at the books thoroughly and included many references from the book.
Sue- I am glad to see you reread this book. It looks as though you walked away with more background knowledge and a new perspective of the book.
Kim, I think you did a great job showing the guidelines these authors used that Oyate suggests. No book is perfect, but the effort is there.
ReplyDeleteNathan, I like the idea of having the kids using the Oyate guidelines; I think it would be more meaningful for them.
I indeed did and happy I reread it. Enjoy your trip to the Crow Reservation.Thanks for taking us on this journey this summer. The time and thought putting into providing this opportunity is much appreciated.
ReplyDeleteI think this book could be effectively used in a high school classroom as a way to look at properly researched material, as part of a boarding school unit or as part of a book club as we have done. It could be compared to documentaries such as Class C or Jim Thorpe. When reading this book I found it difficult to keep track of the characters, where they came from, their tribal affiliation and their family background and even their age. I think this is an important part of who the girls are. I would create character charts that recorded all of this information and also create a timeline to record major events in the girls’ lives and events in the book. I would include other important events from the time as well. I think older students could have discussions on the girls experiences, what drove them and how they were treated.
ReplyDeleteCounting Coup and Full Court Quest were both researched in very different manners, Colton used personal experience and some interviews (he states) and Peavey and Smith using many different sources and referenced those sources completely and appropriately. Full Court Quest is much more legitimate and follows Oyates guidelines even though the author’s aren’t native. I found myself looking up other information as a result of all of the footnotes and had to stop looking at them. Colton’s book does a lot to promote stereotypes but it was part of his story and hopefully could be used as a way to look at and discuss how prejudice and racism can divide and hurt people. It could help promote an understanding of others and what they may have to go through. Colton could have written his story with a broader angle possibly. Here is a link to a Sports Illustrated story that most I would bet inspired Colton, it is also about Crow basketball and is similar to Colton’s writing:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1118885/index.htm
Colton’s story may be upsetting but Native American students still have a high dropout rate and therefore many are obviously not going on to college. A recent article that discusses this issue: http://diverseeducation.com/article/13555/
This book club has given me a lot of background knowledge, it was enlightening to reread a book and look at it from a different perspective. Full Court Quest gave me a different perspective on the boarding school experience. I would encourage others to participate!
All of the learning experiences I have acquired because of IEFA have made me look at things related to Native Americans in a different manner. I have long been interested in Native Americans in history and as contemporaries but I find myself trying to find out things I never thought of before; on a recent trip to Idaho I was curious about the tribes that traditionally lived there and did a little research (thanks to the Internet for making information so easily accessible) to find out. I don’t think I would have thought of that a few years ago.
Dori- I also enjoyed hearing from my peers, everyone had excellent points to make and added things that I had not thought of.
ReplyDeleteKim- thanks for the opportunity, much appreciated!
I also wanted to add that if one was using the sports theme in the classroom it would be the perfect time to examine the mascot issue as well. The possibilities with these books are endless.
ReplyDeleteI know I am late for this blog but I was busy going to sporting events. This would be a great book to use in a middle or high school list. The history in it is wonderful. Obviously there is the whole boarding school aspect and there could also be research done about the "mixed" marriages. I was surprised most of these students came from these marriages. Students could make a map showing where all the students came from, the year, and where they originally went to school. A play could also be written by students on different areas. Students could also do a 3D model of the St. Louis Fair. There are all kinds of possibilities. Thanks to all of you for your thoughts and suggestions. I have really enjoyed the book club.
ReplyDeleteSorry for being a late bird. I think this book would be a great whole language unit for a middle school teacher team. Ex. Band plays Sousa marches, PE does early b-ball and club routines, FACS makes a bloomers and middie uniform or studies the vocational methods or fine needle work done by the students at Fort Shaw, Art does portraits of the main characters, , well, like that, but with the whole staff. The other's in this book club have come up with great project ideas. I liked Vicki's idea about mapping or replicating the World's Fair. I had even considered excerpting the part of the book where the team arrives at the fair and digging up examples of the music and literary works performed, as well as an idea of a visual on Geronimo, Helen Keller (how awesome is she), and the various village tribes represented. Is there a Fort Shaw trunk from Helena available? Sue, your club routine idea was also nice. I can't even imagine what it must have entailed. Reading about how the fair was organized reminded me of The Devil in the White City, which follows the making of the Chicago World's Fair mixed in with a crime story. A kid version of a world's fair experience is Fair Weather, by Richard Peck, which involves the same Chicago event. It talks about the fair site, the Wild West Show and Lilly Langtry, coupled with a vivid portrait of a family experiencing the fair. (Very humorous).
ReplyDeleteComparing Larry Coulton's book with FCQ is an interesting endeavor. The former was "one man's opinion" and the latter had many hands and was footnoted and much more even-handed and respectful. (I considered sending my grandma a copy- she loves Montana books, but not salty language). I would recommend FCQ for a younger crowd, as well. Members of our high school school staff recently looked at some passages from Coulton's book which were unmistakeably biased and inflammatory, and I found myself thinking I'd like to read that Sports Illustrated article that inspired him to write the book. (Yeah, Traci)! I actually heard the author do a reading from CC at a history conference in Helena many years ago. I really got the sense that he is all about heightening the drama ie. the pressure cooker that was Sharon LaForge's teenage life and that he flat-out loves basketball. Where Coulton dramatically described game after game, the author's of FCQ did a credible job of recreating a few key games, but for a book about the birth of western basketball their games were written as kind of a snooze. In fact the capacity for the F.S. team to win every time should be celebrated, but the latter half of the book was made more interesting by better character development than the first half. It was difficult for me to get to know the main characters at first with such choppy paragraphs, and, like, Traci. I think a chart of the characters would have been helpful. It is interesting to note that there were a few similar situations from each book, such as the parents with drinking problems and the family-related social scandals which hurt and embarassed the students. (Many kinds of people can relate to that). Where CC would use that to drive the story, FCQ would politely state the facts, but dwell on other more positive things, as well. In some cases, sticking to the story line sidestepped some fertile material--mainly the frequency of boarding school boys running away. That was glossed over almost every time. Peavy and Smith had a lot of things to cover, however, and I appreciate the updates on the characters at the end. (Loved the photo of the Wirth women and also Belle on her horse with her F.S. uniform). Is anyone surprised by McCowan's legal troubles? It's almost like a Dickensian show biz character-- often on the wrong side of the law, although appealing). And what if that handful of girls had taken up the reverend on his offer of Vassar? In retrospect it seemed like an iffy opportunity, but, if genuine, for some of the characters who fell on hard times it might have made a difference. My heart goes out to Minnie for the tragic events of the Lemhi march. Friday Tindore's tears at seeing his mother's photographs for the first time and hearing her story is simply moving.
ReplyDeleteI would recommend this book club and I thank Kim so much for being the educational star that she is. Thanks also to my thoughtful fellow book clubbers. I feel I have gotten to know your minds so much better than through our brief, distracted encounters at school. Thanks to IEFA and OPI for creating meaningful and also practical opportunities for teachers. Keep going!
Comparing Larry Coulton's book with FCQ is an interesting endeavor. The former was "one man's opinion" and the latter had many hands and was footnoted and much more even-handed and respectful. (I considered sending my grandma a copy- she loves Montana books, but not salty language). I would recommend FCQ for a younger crowd, as well. Members of our high school school staff recently looked at some passages from Coulton's book which were unmistakeably biased and inflammatory, and I found myself thinking I'd like to read that Sports Illustrated article that inspired him to write the book. (Yeah, Traci)! I actually heard the author do a reading from CC at a history conference in Helena many years ago. I really got the sense that he is all about heightening the drama ie. the pressure cooker that was Sharon LaForge's teenage life and that he flat-out loves basketball. Where Coulton dramatically described game after game, the author's of FCQ did a credible job of recreating a few key games, but for a book about the birth of western basketball their games were written as kind of a snooze. In fact the capacity for the F.S. team to win every time should be celebrated, but the latter half of the book was made more interesting by better character development than the first half. It was difficult for me to get to know the main characters at first with such choppy paragraphs, and, like, Traci. I think a chart of the characters would have been helpful. It is interesting to note that there were a few similar situations from each book, such as the parents with drinking problems and the family-related social scandals which hurt and embarassed the students. (Many kinds of people can relate to that). Where CC would use that to drive the story, FCQ would politely state the facts, but dwell on other more positive things, as well. In some cases, sticking to the story line sidestepped some fertile material--mainly the frequency of boarding school boys running away. That was glossed over almost every time. Peavy and Smith had a lot of things to cover, however, and I appreciate the updates on the characters at the end. (Loved the photo of the Wirth women and also Belle on her horse with her F.S. uniform). Is anyone surprised by McCowan's legal troubles? It's almost like a Dickensian show biz character-- often on the wrong side of the law, although appealing). And what if that handful of girls had taken up the reverend on his offer of Vassar? In retrospect it seemed like an iffy opportunity, but, if genuine, for some of the characters who fell on hard times it might have made a difference. My heart goes out to Minnie for the tragic events of the Lemhi march. Friday Tindore's tears at seeing his mother's photographs for the first time and hearing her story is simply moving.
ReplyDeleteApologies again. Posting comments is hard when your computer is bewitched. It sometimes seems like it won't cooperate. I see I spelled Colton's name incorrectly and should have said Emma on her horse was a great picture instead of Belle.
ReplyDelete